{"id":70204,"date":"2020-01-05T16:00:12","date_gmt":"2020-01-05T16:00:12","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/coforge.site\/cigniti_new\/?post_type=product&p=70204"},"modified":"2024-10-21T06:31:42","modified_gmt":"2024-10-21T06:31:42","slug":"digital-transformation-banking-qa-with-paul-trotter","status":"publish","type":"product","link":"https:\/\/coforge.site\/cigniti_new\/resource\/podcasts\/digital-transformation-banking-qa-with-paul-trotter\/","title":{"rendered":"Embracing Newer Technologies for Banks With a Focus on Quality@Speed"},"content":{"rendered":"

You are listening to QA talks, a podcast for quality assurance executives implementing digital transformation in their organizations. In this show<\/span><\/i>,<\/span><\/i>\u00a0we focus on the unique pitfalls inherent in quality assurance and quality engineering and how these executives are navigating them to position the<\/span><\/i>ir<\/span><\/i>\u00a0organization for the future. Let’s get into the show.<\/span><\/i>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

\u202f<\/span><\/b>Logan:\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Welcome back to QA talks. I am your host for today\u2019s episode, Logan Lyles\u00a0<\/span>from\u00a0<\/span>Sweet<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>Fish<\/span>\u00a0M<\/span>edia<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0I am joined today by Paul Trotter. He is the Deputy Chief Technology Officer over at Atom Bank<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0and also our co-presenter today, Nanda Padmaraju, the Senior VP at Cigniti Technologies.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Gentlemen, how is it going today?<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0Hi,\u00a0<\/span>thank you so much for having me on the show. It’s great to be here. Hey, Nanda.<\/span>\u202f<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Nanda:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0Hi Logan. Thanks for having me. It\u2019s a pleasure to be a co-presenter along with Paul on th<\/span>is<\/span>\u00a0podcast.<\/span>\u00a0Thank you.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan<\/span><\/b>:\u202f<\/span><\/b>Absolutely. I am excited to chat with you guys today. For listeners, a little bit of background on Paul first. As we mentioned, Paul is currently the deputy CTO over at Atom Bank<\/span>. He is\u00a0<\/span>accountable for service delivery and change including testing and DevOps. Prior to taking on his current role at Atom, he was responsible for the change in environments. He has also previously worked at Accenture and Capco. Outside of work, he lives in Preston in UK with his wife, two kids, and two dogs, most importantly there.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

And then, over to Nanda. Nanda Padmaraju is our co-speaker for this edition of the podcast. Nanda heads the UK and EU business unit for Cigniti. Nanda brings in 22 years of experience in consulting, advising<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0and helping global enterprises across domains in their quality assurance and quality engineering transformation.\u202f<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

During today\u2019s conversation, Nanda will be talking to us a little bit about Cigniti\u2019s expertise, specifically in the banking sector and how his team has helped realize ROI and other benefits for Cigniti clients.\u202f<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

So, guys now that we have got some introductions out of the way for some context, Paul, I would love to open up the conversation to you, specifically to kick things off here.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

You know, Atom has been one of the early adopters in the banking industry of cloud and thought machine. What are some of the critical factors, and I\u00a0<\/span>imagine,\u00a0<\/span>both technical and business factors are at play here that cost you guys to make the leap forward, ahead of some of your industry peers?\u202f<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul:\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Okay. So, thanks for the question in terms of why now, which is quite obviously an important thing because we’re only a young bank. We’ve only been there since\u00a0<\/span>2014<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span>So w<\/span>hy would we go for\u00a0<\/span>very smart\u00a0<\/span>data\u00a0<\/span>centers<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>and<\/span>\u00a0third parties in\u00a0<\/span>to the cloud.\u00a0<\/span>But effectively because<\/span>, it<\/span>\u2019<\/span>s so important, t<\/span>he flexibility it gives you. The regulations are now far more comfortable\u00a0<\/span>with it<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>and\u00a0<\/span>with the speed of change<\/span>. To get control about changes<\/span>\u00a0and get with<\/span>in<\/span>\u00a0the cloud is absolutely critical.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>So, you’re able to scale up and down based on customer demand. In the past<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0we have been hit by challenges around things like self-campaigns\u00a0<\/span>with few of the best\u00a0<\/span>banks<\/span>. Why thought machine? Well, thought machine is\u00a0<\/span>cloud native.\u00a0<\/span>If\u00a0<\/span>you<\/span>\u00a0are<\/span>\u00a0go<\/span>ing to move to<\/span>\u00a0the cloud<\/span>,\u00a0<\/span>you don’t just want to move your data center. You need to move your products and your components to actually cloud native so you can then utilize the features as part of it. So that then you can work through the pace of change. But it’s really important under the market now that you’re nimble.\u00a0<\/span>So,<\/span>\u00a0before we build bigger and bigger offerings, the best thing for us to do, particularly<\/span>\u00a0for<\/span>\u00a0the regulator<\/span>s<\/span>\u00a0are now is to move into the cloud at our earliest opportunity and basically b<\/span>r<\/span>ing Atom bank back into our bank itself rather than being delivered through a number of third parties.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan<\/span><\/b>:\u202f<\/span><\/b>Yeah<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0that makes a lot of sense about looking at your move to the cloud very holistically and you make a great point there about the business factors, the flexibility, and scalability that the cloud brings. So\u00a0<\/span>also,<\/span>\u00a0you know as and your current role as deputy CTO at A<\/span>tom\u00a0<\/span>bank, Paul, can you tell us a little bit about your view of quality engineering across the software development life cycle.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul<\/span><\/b>:\u202f<\/span><\/b>Yeah<\/span>, a<\/span>bsolutely<\/span>. So,<\/span>\u00a0I mean<\/span>, quality\u00a0<\/span>engineering is very important, particularly in<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>a<\/span>\u00a0bank<\/span>. Every<\/span>thing that goes live h<\/span>as\u00a0<\/span>to be stable<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>It\u00a0<\/span>has to be secure<\/span>d<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0number one<\/span>, and h<\/span>as to work<\/span>. So<\/span>, in sort of the old world of data centers and<\/span>\u00a0everything else<\/span>, culture,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>quality\u00a0<\/span>engineering<\/span>, and the waterfall<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>model<\/span>s<\/span>\u00a0meant that I\u00a0<\/span>had to\u00a0<\/span>pretty much\u00a0<\/span>work t<\/span>owards the end of the cycle and it was very difficult\u00a0<\/span>to move\u00a0<\/span>ahead. And\u00a0<\/span>now<\/span>, we are\u00a0<\/span>utilizing the cloud<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0utilizing natural pipelines\u00a0<\/span>that I could build on to\u00a0<\/span>my DevOps team<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0Effectively<\/span>,\u00a0<\/span>I can think o<\/span>f all\u00a0<\/span>tests<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>not just earlier, but\u00a0<\/span>I can just\u00a0<\/span>make\u00a0<\/span>it\u00a0<\/span>continuous<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>So\u00a0<\/span>as soon as people integrate test<\/span>bed<\/span>, I can instantly start testing\u00a0<\/span>for that to be\u00a0<\/span>functional and non<\/span>–<\/span>functional testing<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span>And it all went to that\u00a0<\/span>so that I can get<\/span>\u00a0defects<\/span>\u00a0out early and start<\/span>\u00a0proving and understanding<\/span>\u00a0actually<\/span>\u00a0what I meant when I\u00a0<\/span>wrote<\/span>\u00a0down th<\/span>os<\/span>e requirements<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span>So, from a software\u00a0<\/span>development\u00a0<\/span>lifecycle perspective,\u00a0<\/span>we need to be careful about methodologies\u00a0<\/span>and what is really important.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>D<\/span>evOps is part of the cloud<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>The\u00a0<\/span>environments<\/span>\u00a0that open up to as much as we\u2019d like enables\u00a0<\/span>you<\/span>\u00a0to effectively shift left\u00a0<\/span>from\u00a0<\/span>both<\/span>\u00a0functional and non-functional perspective<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0So that you can truly do<\/span>\u00a0very short\u00a0<\/span>sprints<\/span>,\u00a0<\/span>all the way through production rather than short spreads that then stop and then get formed into some big monster release.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan<\/span><\/b>:\u202f<\/span><\/b>Are\u00a0<\/span>there a few specific initiatives that you could possibly speak to<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0Paul<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0to bring this down to the very tactical level that others might be able to learn from<\/span>\u00a0\u2013\u00a0<\/span>where you’ve helped drive adoption of the agile methodology<\/span>, as well as you<\/span>\u00a0know<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0made quality an integral part throughout the process<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>Like\u00a0<\/span>you said<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0moving it earlier into your own processes.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>In terms of quality<\/span>, it\u2019s really around\u00a0<\/span>automation from a quality\u00a0<\/span>engineer<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0So,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>it\u2019s<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>a\u00a0<\/span>turn around the predictability<\/span>. It\u2019s about bui<\/span>lding the regression\u00a0<\/span>test early.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>It’s\u00a0<\/span>about actually\u00a0<\/span>be<\/span>ing able to have a<\/span>\u00a0fifteen<\/span>–<\/span>minute test when you\u00a0<\/span>go and\u00a0<\/span>integrate<\/span>\u00a0it<\/span>\u00a0into the\u00a0<\/span>bra<\/span>nch<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span>It\u2019s<\/span>\u00a0about\u00a0<\/span>going about<\/span>\u00a0taking the ten<\/span>–<\/span>hour test if you get\u00a0<\/span>it overnight<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span>However,\u00a0<\/span>it’s more than\u00a0<\/span>that<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>It\u00a0<\/span>is about the fact that\u00a0<\/span>I\u2019ll never ha<\/span>ve multiple environments that are not identical and built the same<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0That\u00a0<\/span>mean<\/span>s<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>I can t<\/span>he<\/span>n<\/span>\u00a0go on and execute multiple parallel items of testing that are functional and non<\/span>–<\/span>functional at the same time<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>to go and prove to<\/span>\u00a0us<\/span>\u00a0that actually<\/span>\u00a0that\u00a0<\/span>change<\/span>\u00a0that\u2019s made the right difference and<\/span>\u00a0no additional differences.\u00a0<\/span>So,<\/span>\u00a0it is really the key about it going forward, and it is how from a test predict<\/span>ive<\/span>\u00a0perspective<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>You\u00a0<\/span>could start using analysis and additional\u00a0<\/span>data points<\/span>\u00a0to then decide<\/span>\u00a0actually what really matters.\u00a0<\/span>. For your test you can do it in the right order rather than just saying I’m going to go and do a 200 tests.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan<\/span><\/b>:\u202f<\/span><\/b>Paul\u00a0<\/span>that makes a lot of sense and I appreciate you sharing some very specific examples there.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Nanda, if we could kick it over to you for a little bit from your perspective from the Cigniti side. You know Cigniti works with several well<\/span>–<\/span>known clients in the banking sector. I would love to hear your thoughts on the role that QA plays amid banks who are embracing digital transformation and move to the cloud<\/span>\u00a0and\u00a0<\/span>these other factors that are going on, as Paul has described a little bit within his organization.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Nanda<\/span><\/b>:\u202f<\/span><\/b>Absolutely, Logan. Challenging banks like Atom, wh<\/span>ich is\u00a0<\/span>a digital-only bank are\u00a0<\/span>pushing<\/span>\u00a0the status quo and setting newer benchmarks in not only adopting the latest technologies but also accelerated time to market.\u00a0<\/span>So,<\/span>\u00a0this is forcing legacy banks to accelerate their own pace of digital transformation.\u202f<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

So, as you know, every bank today has an app for\u00a0<\/span>its<\/span>\u00a0customers, both on iOS and Android. The customer is oblivious to the fact that there are legacy applications running with most of these banks<\/span>, well<\/span>–<\/span>known banks<\/span>\u00a0and expects a superior customer experience for all his or her transactions. Customers have zero-tolerance these days and can quickly vent their anger on various social media platforms.\u00a0<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

In this backdrop, testing the functional and non-functional aspects thoroughly<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0and as Paul rightly said, embedding quality engineering early on in the lifecycle is extremely important and imperative for the banks to succeed in this digital age. So, QA and QE are the top order in terms of a CTO or a CIO level risk in today\u2019s board-room meetings.\u202f<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>I think you know whether you’re in the banking sector or any other industry you know the point that you make their Nanda about the expectation for a frictionless customer experience is there across continents across industries throughout our lives today<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>So,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>I love the connection that you’re making there between QA and QE and the customer experience and the very tail end of the process which obviously has major business implications no matter the size of your organization<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0I love what you’re talking about there Nanda.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul, back over to you real quick<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>You\u00a0<\/span>know a lot of IT leaders are really faced with this conundrum and they feel like they either have to choose quality or time and they have to prioritize one or the other. From what I’m told you’re a strong believer in quality and speed. Can you elaborate on this a little bit further on the impact of embracing the reality that you can actually have quality and speed at the same time<\/span>?<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul<\/span><\/b>:\u202f<\/span><\/b>Sure!\u00a0<\/span>So<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0in terms of actually quality over time in the legacy world of data centers, a limited number of environments<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0where it takes a long time to implement change<\/span>, you have largely got no choice but to go\u00a0<\/span>with\u00a0<\/span>quality, because if you g<\/span>et it<\/span>\u00a0wrong, it takes such a long time to then go right, trying to fix it. Unless you are forced to go by time, you really have to purely go by\u00a0<\/span>quality,<\/span>\u00a0and\u00a0<\/span>it has to work the first<\/span>\u00a0time.\u202f<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

The challenge then is, by the time it goes in, it is quite possibly\u00a0<\/span>irrelevant,<\/span>\u00a0o<\/span>r it is just everything else has moved.\u00a0<\/span>Quality\u00a0<\/span>at<\/span>\u00a0speed\u00a0<\/span>is<\/span>\u00a0really where\u00a0<\/span>we<\/span>\u00a0need to go\u00a0<\/span>and<\/span>\u00a0actually\u00a0<\/span>where\u00a0<\/span>we<\/span>\u00a0can go now with the cloud, with true agile, with DevOps, with quality engineering and\u00a0<\/span>the concept underneath<\/span>\u00a0it. Because we want something<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0and we don\u2019t know\u00a0<\/span>exactly<\/span>\u00a0what it is going to be like<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>We\u00a0<\/span>know what it should\u00a0<\/span>f<\/span>e<\/span>el\u00a0<\/span>like<\/span>. We need space to go and implement<\/span>\u00a0that quickly<\/span>, a<\/span>nd then tailor it and then just keep on tuning it effectively<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>Rather\u00a0<\/span>than making changes which are\u00a0<\/span>big and<\/span>\u00a0cumbersome and takes too long to do and like it t<\/span>o be\u00a0<\/span>pro.\u00a0<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

If I c<\/span>an\u00a0<\/span>turn things<\/span>, it would be far<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>quicker<\/span>\u00a0in the best case<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0I can do them within a day. Best case or actually<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>even\u00a0<\/span>in the\u00a0<\/span>worst case, I\u00a0<\/span>can do it in a 2-weeks expense.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>And\u00a0<\/span>every time\u00a0<\/span>we got<\/span>\u00a0some<\/span>\u00a0tangible benefits and then the customer can give me real feedback<\/span>. So even if I thought about the<\/span>\u00a0best analysis requirements<\/span>\u00a0right at the beginning<\/span>,\u00a0<\/span>actually<\/span>, I now\u00a0<\/span>know for sure<\/span>\u00a0now I do.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>Even\u00a0<\/span>if they are not as fully documented because they are now fully\u00a0<\/span>tested and\u00a0<\/span>fully\u00a0<\/span>use<\/span>\u00a0teste<\/span>d by the customer,\u00a0<\/span>the client is going to touch this and<\/span>\u00a0use it on a day-to-day basis.\u00a0<\/span>So, quality<\/span>\u00a0at<\/span>\u00a0speed\u00a0<\/span>are<\/span>\u00a0only<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>possible<\/span>, though, if you\u2019re<\/span>\u00a0actually confident around\u00a0<\/span>wherever the changes<\/span>\u00a0have<\/span>\u00a0be<\/span>en<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>mad<\/span>e<\/span>\u00a0what the impact of those changes are<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0and actually\u00a0<\/span>what the likelihood is if any issue<\/span>s are born, and<\/span>\u00a0the fact that if there was one, you can fix it instantly.\u00a0<\/span>And, that\u2019s why it\u2019s fair.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan<\/span><\/b>:\u202f<\/span><\/b>Yeah<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0that makes a lot of sense Paul<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>You\u00a0<\/span>know as we’ve been talking about<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0not just with A<\/span>tom\u00a0<\/span>though<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0but banks are finally embracing and moving to the cloud. A<\/span>tom<\/span>\u00a0has successfully migrated to Google cloud platform. HSBC is another major bank that has started its migration started migrating its workloads over to GCP as well. Can you tell us a little bit how this is helping you from a quality engineering\u00a0<\/span>perspective?<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul<\/span><\/b>:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Sure<\/span>. S<\/span>o<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0from a quality engineering perspective<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0what really helps in the non<\/span>–<\/span>functional perspective and in the actual ability to run things in parallel<\/span>, because<\/span>\u00a0historically environments take a long time to stand out and not\u00a0<\/span>like<\/span>ly bringing\u00a0<\/span>clarity<\/span>\u00a0between them<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>So,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>you can get different<\/span>\u00a0test results<\/span>\u00a0in each one and the cost of running an environment that<\/span>\u2019s\u00a0<\/span>parallel to production from the non<\/span>–<\/span>functional perspective.\u00a0<\/span>So<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0you do scaling,<\/span>\u00a0because<\/span>\u00a0it just makes it not realistic and because it’s sitting there for such a long period time when it’s not being used<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>So<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>given<\/span>\u00a0the benefits of going to Google cloud and everything else around\u00a0<\/span>it in terms of the tools of such services and\u00a0<\/span>everything else is you can instantly\u00a0<\/span>standup<\/span>\u00a0up an environment. So, depending on its own component you can do it very much in less than an hour. And the full environment end-to-end before we turn to end connectivity<\/span>\u00a0to third-parties as well as the components that can build the<\/span>\u00a0whole bank in\u00a0<\/span>match with\u00a0<\/span>3 to 5 days<\/span>\u00a0depending on the complexity around it<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0But<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>In terms of actually what that really means I can now\u00a0<\/span>triage defects quicker<\/span>\u00a0and do more parallel activity. I can do more programs in parallel. I cannot<\/span>\u00a0be<\/span>\u00a0just try<\/span>ing<\/span>\u00a0things\u00a0<\/span>and hope that they\u00a0<\/span>are going to work.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>We’ll see if they’re going to work<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>There is constant expense of time and effort.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>People often goes emotionally attached to it.\u00a0<\/span>So,<\/span>\u00a0there’s lots of benefits for\u00a0<\/span>such as the<\/span>\u00a0flexibility only with ourselves. We’re no longer having conversations with a third party and\u00a0<\/span>say<\/span>\u00a0I’d like<\/span>\u00a0you<\/span>\u00a0to do that\u00a0<\/span>for<\/span>\u00a0us<\/span>, document it<\/span>. And then they’ll to come back right after. You’ll argue it’s a fill up. Then eventually they’ll do well to schedule some people to go and find to it. And then it comes through at the other end and turmoil that’s happened, which we can be months to three months pos<\/span>t<\/span>. And that’s what kills, that just kills the business because actually they’re not working in technology to that extent. We utilize the technology to grow\u00a0<\/span>an end result to that to the<\/span>\u00a0customer.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan<\/span><\/b>:\u202f<\/span><\/b>I love the way that you ended that\u00a0<\/span>there<\/span>\u00a0Paul<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0talking about using technology to provide the end result to the customer<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>And<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>you point<\/span>ed<\/span>\u00a0out a lot of things along the way there that are affected when you’re able to do<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0as you say quality at speed<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>Nanda,\u00a0<\/span>could you\u00a0<\/span>talk\u00a0<\/span>on this topic of speed a little bit<\/span>?<\/span>\u00a0I would love for you to elaborate a little bit on Cigniti\u2019s test automation framework that helps clients<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0specifically in the banking industry. Maybe a few examples\u00a0<\/span>on<\/span>\u00a0how it’s helped to jump<\/span>–<\/span>start testing events and deliver solutions more quickly<\/span>?<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Nanda:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Sure Logan, as Agile and DevOps become mainstream, test automation is a foundational pillar<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0as alluded by Paul earlier. That acts as an enabler to achieve the end objectives. Cigniti has harnessed its experience and expertise of serving clients across banking<\/a> and financial services<\/a> sector into reusable assets such as test automation frameworks, test environment health check kits, test data generators, white level testing harnesses<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>And<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>all these come as value adds to our customers at the hel<\/span>p<\/span>\u00a0avoid<\/span>ing<\/span>\u00a0reinventing the wheel.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

The IP and the reusable framework that we bring to the table significantly lower the break even point in test automation and enhance the ROI over the life cycle for our customers. And particularly for banking as Paul alluded earlier, moving to the cloud helps them to achieve speed and agility. And without test automation, you would become the roadblock or the dead-end for customers. So, test automation<\/a> is foundational and Cigniti\u2019s strength is in test automation.\u202f<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan<\/span><\/b>:\u202f<\/span><\/b>Thanks for that Nanda<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span>Paul do you have some thoughts on the tools<\/span>\u00a0used<\/span>\u00a0for test automation that you want to add here.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Some of the tools that we talk about\u00a0<\/span>to\u00a0<\/span>test in a way where you’re likely to\u00a0<\/span>find\u00a0<\/span>defects. It also goes from that\u00a0<\/span>dev<\/span>\u00a0into the ops touch.\u00a0<\/span>You<\/span>\u00a0know<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>have\u00a0<\/span>you got consistent to<\/span>ols\u00a0<\/span>in and does it go feed automatically through that too? So<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0if you’re going to use things like Jira and confluent within the development lifecycle, then you also if you’re go to use service now or something similar or the products are available within the production world, then it’s kind of how those two areas talk<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>But<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>also how they feed back into the test automation and the scope of everything else in your test predicting because you might think you’re doing amazing testing and you only tend to hear about ones and twos in production. But there’s lots of other things that are taking place and noise that you can just go and quickly fix. You need to have our data feeding through that data<\/span>–<\/span>driven world. And test is by far the most important things around that data because it allows you to a if you want to be testing\u00a0<\/span>whether\u00a0<\/span>the customer would use it and also enables you to focus your testing in the areas that are key to\u00a0<\/span>everybody<\/span>\u00a0or where you think it’s best for them.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Yeah<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0Paul spoke to a lot of the things they can get in the way and slow your progress<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0Nanda<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0as you’ve worked with organizations across the banking industry are there a few\u00a0<\/span>keys,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>a few specific benefits that you<\/span>\u2019re<\/span>\u00a0seeing your banking industry customers who have really been able to realize\u00a0<\/span>in their QA<\/span>\u00a0transformation journey by partnering with Cigniti and what you guys have been able to do for them.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Nanda:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Sure Logan, I’ll pick<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>up four use cases and outline the benefits that some of our customers have derived. Cigniti has global patents and believes in intellectual property and put that intellectual property to use for our customers. The first one is something called\u00a0<\/span>CESTA,\u00a0<\/span>which is\u00a0<\/span>a part<\/span>\u00a0of our Blue Swan IP which helps in migrating test assets from one technology and\u00a0<\/span>tool<\/span>\u00a0landscap<\/span>e<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>to another<\/span>. Some of our banking customers have requested us to migrate their test assets\u00a0<\/span>from<\/span>\u00a0commercial toolsets to open<\/span>–<\/span>source toolsets. Cigniti is the only company that has this migration platform\u00a0<\/span>and<\/span>\u00a0we have put\u00a0<\/span>this platform\u00a0<\/span>to<\/span>\u00a0use for those migration customers. This is one benefit that our banking customers have realized.\u00a0<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

And the second one is something called the\u00a0<\/span>as\u00a0<\/span>sentiment analyzer, this is\u00a0<\/span>again an<\/span>\u00a0intellectual property that we have. So essentially<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0this tool that can crawl\u00a0<\/span>all<\/span>\u00a0the social media platforms<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0the apps store ratings<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0and comments by various end<\/span>–<\/span>users o<\/span>f<\/span>\u00a0these apps and\u00a0<\/span>come up with<\/span>\u00a0meaningful inferences that are actionable from the quality engineering standpoint.\u00a0<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

So essentially somebody would have rated four for an app on iOS and 3.5\u00a0<\/span>on<\/span>\u00a0Android. But the number\u00a0<\/span>themselves\u00a0<\/span>does not make any meaning from the quality engineering perspective<\/span>,\u00a0<\/span>unless you\u00a0<\/span>go through the<\/span>\u00a0comments the same\u00a0<\/span>person<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>would have said that the<\/span>\u00a0app is\u00a0<\/span>rebooting itself<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>for multiple times at this point<\/span>\u00a0of the<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>journey<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>and which<\/span>\u00a0essentially\u00a0<\/span>takes<\/span>\u00a0the\u00a0<\/span>point<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>of acknowledging it as a bug and putting it\u00a0<\/span>into the backlog in our product development l<\/span>ife cycle.\u00a0<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

So,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>there<\/span>\u00a0sentiment\u00a0<\/span>analyzer<\/span>\u00a0significantly help<\/span>s<\/span>\u00a0harness the actual<\/span>\u00a0feedback from the end<\/span>–<\/span>users into the quality engineering lifecycle for our customers. So\u00a0<\/span>that\u2019s<\/span>\u00a0another IP\u00a0<\/span>that\u2019s been<\/span>\u00a0put in use for our customers<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span>And\u00a0<\/span>the third one is the faster time to market<\/span>. S<\/span>o here<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0as customer and the technology\u00a0<\/span>are<\/span>\u00a0helping us embrace with a comprehensive<\/span>\u00a0test<\/span>\u00a0strategy that is tune<\/span>d<\/span>\u00a0towards\u00a0<\/span>agile and DevOps<\/span>\u00a0and shifting left and shifting right<\/span>. S<\/span>o<\/span>, in<\/span>\u00a0the current age of D<\/span>evOps<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>it\u2019<\/span>s no longer sufficient t<\/span>hat you<\/span>\u00a0shift left but you also need to shift right to be able to do the proper handshake with the<\/span>\u00a0Ops team<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span><\/b>So<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Cigniti has proven methodologies to embed shift left and shift right into the overall software test life cycle within the\u00a0<\/span>DevOps<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

L<\/span>astly<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0continuous testing<\/span>\u00a0\u2013\u00a0<\/span>this is again something that\u00a0<\/span>Paul<\/span>\u00a0has cited in his\u00a0<\/span>earlier\u00a0<\/span>comments that\u00a0<\/span>continuous testing aided by<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>test automation<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>framework has significantly helped drive results and benefits for<\/span>\u00a0our customers<\/span>, whether it is launching their app in record time<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>or moving over or<\/span>\u00a0migrating from\u00a0<\/span>data center to cloud\u00a0<\/span>and so on\u00a0<\/span>and\u00a0<\/span>so forth<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

A<\/span>nd the last one is<\/span>, Cigniti being an<\/span>\u00a0independent testing organization<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0we have\u00a0<\/span>t<\/span>ool<\/span>\u00a0partnership with various commercial toolsets<\/span>\u00a0and we also\u00a0<\/span>are a big proponent of embracing<\/span>\u00a0open source\u00a0<\/span>technologies<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>So,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>customers have a significantly benefited from se<\/span>lecting the<\/span>\u00a0right tool of their choice\u00a0<\/span>at various points in their journey<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0which\u00a0<\/span>suit the underlying<\/span>\u00a0technology application and landscape and\u00a0<\/span>their own roadmap.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>S<\/span>o<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0these I think\u00a0<\/span>are<\/span>\u00a0the top four benefits that customers\u00a0<\/span>have\u00a0<\/span>realized<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>after\u00a0<\/span>partnering with Cigniti in their journey.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>I really appreciate that input Nanda<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>You\u00a0<\/span>know a lot of folks when they’re looking for information<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0they’re looking for what are my peers able\u00a0<\/span>to accomplish<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0they’re looking for those sort of specific stor<\/span>ies<\/span>. S<\/span>o, I<\/span>\u00a0appreciate you unpacking those a little bit for folks\u00a0<\/span>and\u00a0<\/span>speaking to some of the specific use cases that you’ve seen as you work with banking industry customers.\u00a0<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0back over to you for a second<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>I<\/span>t seems like there’s been a recurring theme through this conversation about driving value to the end customers<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>We<\/span>\u2019ve<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>talked a little bit about removing friction<\/span>. Nanda<\/span>\u00a0was just speaking a little bit about more efficiently gathering sentiment and feedback from end<\/span>–<\/span>users and one of the things that you guys have done is implementing smart contracts<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>Can\u00a0<\/span>you speak to the benefit\u00a0<\/span>they are<\/span>\u00a0driving value for customers\u00a0<\/span>for<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>Atom<\/span>\u00a0bank<\/span>?<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Yeah<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0sure<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>So<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>in terms of a sm<\/span>art contact and to\u00a0<\/span>just explain\u00a0<\/span>that<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>concept<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>of the contract\u00a0<\/span>in terms of effect of a thought machine<\/span>\u00a0and<\/span>\u00a0our banking\u00a0<\/span>platform and it is not t<\/span>he only<\/span>\u00a0place where it exist<\/span>s<\/span>\u00a0within our stack<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Essentially<\/span>\u00a0it is using\u00a0<\/span>thought machine<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>banking platform than allowing us to do the actual development on top of it using the contract<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>It\u00a0<\/span>is a bit like\u00a0<\/span>using excel and then using the sheet yourself on your own\u00a0<\/span>formulas then<\/span>\u00a0and based on<\/span>\u00a0known<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>excel<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>formulas<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span>So\u00a0<\/span>that then you can create your own products the\u00a0<\/span>massive<\/span>\u00a0benefits\u00a0<\/span>in terms of speed<\/span>\u00a0into\u00a0<\/span>how to utilize\u00a0<\/span>proven<\/span>\u00a0formula<\/span>s<\/span>\u00a0underneath\u00a0<\/span>that are known to work and that<\/span>\u00a0you can adapt\u00a0<\/span>to\u00a0<\/span>your product quickly<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>through your own coding<\/span>\u00a0which is really<\/span>\u00a0the key going forward.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>You<\/span>\u00a0can do that throughout the rest of the stack as well. You\u00a0<\/span>got to<\/span>\u00a0make sure you’re always protecting your data.\u00a0<\/span>But,\u00a0<\/span>beyond that\u00a0<\/span>you need to<\/span>\u00a0know is what you are going to be good at.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>You\u2019re going to be good at designing t<\/span>he<\/span>\u00a0banking products<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0you don’t need to be<\/span>\u00a0good at<\/span>\u00a0everything else<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>You\u00a0<\/span>just need to know what how to utilize\u00a0<\/span>everything else\u00a0<\/span>so<\/span>\u00a0that you can\u00a0<\/span>go\u00a0<\/span>live with that product<\/span>\u00a0and compliant and everything else<\/span>\u00a0that goes<\/span>\u00a0with that.\u00a0<\/span>I’m trying to take what happens and test it all in the line of development early and change. I’m trying to make it there in the land of how does that then get affected by what happens in service production.\u00a0<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>All right<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>So,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>Paul<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0we<\/span>\u2019ve<\/span>\u00a0talked a little bit<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0you know from the very beginning of this conversation about moving ahead<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0adopting newer technologies<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>The\u00a0<\/span>cloud has been obviously a big part of this conversation<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>Can\u00a0<\/span>you share a little bit about your methodology through your experience in adopting your technologies but at the same time identifying potential risk and mitigating th<\/span>ose<\/span>\u00a0risk as you move to newer technologies where you see the benefit to increase quality<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0increase speed<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0increase the customer experience as a whole<\/span>?<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Yeah<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0sure<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>So,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>in terms of actual technology\u00a0<\/span>and<\/span>\u00a0technology<\/span>\u00a0is so<\/span>\u00a0strange because<\/span>\u00a0it\u00a0<\/span>changes<\/span>\u00a0so<\/span>\u00a0quickly and particularly<\/span>\u00a0as Nanda mentioned, we are a digital-only bank, so we\u2019ve only got the one channel which makes it really really important that\u00a0<\/span>it’s always available and got the right services coming off it. So<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0if any of our integral components change, it’s absolutely key that we can plug and play effectively<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0and we can utilize the cloud and utilize the services that are available where\u00a0<\/span>we\u00a0<\/span>work\u00a0<\/span>i<\/span>n the most efficient way. We don’t need to become expert at everything. We just need to be experts at the right things and then stay current so that actually the customers can feel and experience exactly as they would be expect<\/span>ing.\u00a0<\/span>So<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0know when you should be using\u00a0<\/span>the software and<\/span>\u00a0how to configure the\u00a0<\/span>software<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span>There\u00a0<\/span>is no one you should be bringing a lot within the actual bank itself to\u00a0<\/span>e<\/span>nsure that we\u00a0<\/span>got<\/span>\u00a0the control<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

And, absolutely making certain that the data is used appropriately<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>so that actually the service and the quality<\/span>\u00a0and<\/span>\u00a0experience for the customer is all improved as you go along<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>In\u00a0<\/span>terms of choosing components, that’s largely based on<\/span>\u00a0what\u2019s the<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>real<\/span>\u00a0benefit. If what I just made a simple notification service, I don’t need to go to town<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>If\u00a0<\/span>I need actually a far more rich than solution, that’s part of it that I need to look at\u00a0<\/span>that<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>as\u00a0<\/span>well to. If I’m going to do that, the complexity that brings the whole lifecycle<\/span>, w<\/span>hat will that do to my quality\u00a0<\/span>all\u00a0<\/span>that due my time. Our houses are actually therefore to be mean to the end. Customer turns at the end to get upon the speed and somehow look and feel of<\/span>\u00a0that.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>I appreciate that\u00a0<\/span>breakdown<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>Paul<\/span>.<\/span>\u00a0As\u00a0<\/span>we wrap up today<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0you know<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0another<\/span>\u00a0common concern for a lot of technology leaders is both recruiting and retaining tech talent<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span>A\u00a0<\/span>little<\/span>\u00a0bit more\u00a0<\/span>tangent<\/span>\u00a0from our primary conversation today but I think it is worth hearing your perspective on this<\/span>\u00a0as a seasoned tech leader<\/span>. Can you speak to the landscape and some of the things that you\u2019ve seen effective in recruiting & retaining tech talent<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0especially\u00a0<\/span>as<\/span>\u00a0it relates to the culture of your organization & how that can influence either acquiring\u00a0<\/span>of\u00a0<\/span>new talent or retaining those folks once you\u2019ve got them in your team<\/span>?<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul:\u00a0<\/span><\/b>So, it turns out actually that the people need to bond to feel like they belong to a family<\/span>. Th<\/span>e whole culture is about actually feeling like you’re empowered and you’re able to talk and\u00a0<\/span>explain what you want and give ideas and some little respect<\/span>.\u00a0<\/span>Some\u00a0<\/span>of them will help you understand how that works and feels against because we’ve got far more ideas that we’ve got time and money for. But\u00a0<\/span>as<\/span>\u00a0said in terms of recruitment, what that means is if someone doesn’t feel like they’re going to fit in for whatever reason as part of the interview process, which is really, really hard to do, then we go to the tech every single technology box. So then if they won’t command it, it’s because you need the family to feel like it’s still a family. You need to be able to go and deliver because there’s lots of choices out there, particularly the technology that we’re using. It’s leading edge. It’s interesting, not just within the financial services interests industry. It’s also interesting event. There are lots of other industries, including in the local area around here, there’s clothing manufacturers<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0there’s governments, th<\/span>er<\/span>e<\/span>\u2019s<\/span>\u00a0gambling, there’s lots of consulting companies that would like to want to take those people on<\/span>, there are<\/span>\u00a0the financial companies.\u00a0<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

So<\/span>,\u00a0<\/span>it is true that people feel they are valued and that they are rightly rewarded. But actually, they also feel like those that they’ve got a place there they can see a future with us. It’s a challenge to keep the more engaged, given all the ideas and think given the pace of change. But in terms of actually that’s for you on the best challenge of the whole on a daily basis, because, you know, there’s people that we at a bank for us<\/span>,<\/span>\u00a0<\/span>lots,<\/span>\u00a0and lots of times over.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>I love the way that we wrapped it up there, Paul, talking about, you know, the people that are implementing a lot of this technology as we talk about process and methodologies and bringing it back to the people that are involved in how you guys are building that culture at Atom. I appreciate that peek inside the organization a little bit there. If anybody listening to this, Paul, would like to reach out and ask any follow up questions or just stay connected or learn more about Atom Bank. What’s the best way that they could reach out or stay connected to reach out to me or stay connected?<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>They can reach out to me at paul.trotter@atombank.co.uk or just on LinkedIn as Paul Trotter.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Easy enough. Nanda, thank you so much for joining the conversation today as well. If anybody listening to this would like to ask any follow up questions or stay connected with you, what would be the best ways for them to reach out to you specifically?<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Nanda:<\/span><\/b>\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Sure, Logan. Thanks for having me on this podcast. And just like Paul said, I’m active on my LinkedIn as well as on my email. My email is nanda@cigniti.com. And on LinkedIn, if you search for Nanda Padmaraju, you’ll be able to get hold of me. And I’m more than happy to answer questions and stay in touch with the tech community.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Logan:\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Thank you. Great. Well, thank you both, gentlemen, for adding some great insights to the tech community today. That wraps it up for another episode of Q<\/span>A<\/span>\u00a0Talks.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Paul:\u00a0<\/span><\/b>Thanks very much, thanks for having us.<\/span>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

Quality assurance is vital to the success of an organization\u2019s digital transformation. Lack of control can quickly derail a company\u2019s technological presence, costing thousands. At Cigniti, our resolution is to build a better world with better quality software. Renowned for the global quality thought leadership in the industry, we draw expertise from over a decade of test engineering experience across verticals. To learn how we do it, visit cigniti.com.\u00a0<\/span><\/i>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n

You have been listening to QA talks. To ensure that you never miss ay episode, subscribe to the show in your favorite podcast player. Thank you so much for listening, until next time.<\/span><\/i>\u00a0<\/span><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Speakers:\u00a0
Paul Trotter<\/strong>, Deputy Chief Technology Officer at Atom Bank;\u00a0
Nanda Padmaraju<\/strong>, Senior Vice President at Cigniti (A Coforge Company)
\n